Daniel and Isabel Save Classical Music
Classical musician-turned-stand up comedian Isabel Hagen and classical pianist Daniel Anastasio explore their favorite classical pieces while discussing the creative life. Listen along for live musical excerpts paired with banter between two best friends. New episodes every Tuesday.
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Daniel and Isabel Save Classical Music
Pleasure in Melancholy
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Daniel and Isabel talk about Brahms' Intermezzo op. 119 no. 1, which begins his final set of small works for the piano. They discuss Brahms' letter to Clara Schumann about the opening of the piece, the painful desire of the Romantics, and Brahms' organic writing. We also talk about teaching, and why it's not for Isabel.
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Okay, let's start today with what I think is one of the most heartbreaking openings in all of piano. Um in all of piano. In all of the piano. Uh Johannes Brahms, very late in life, wrote these sets of pieces. We already played Opus One Eighteen, a little bit of that, but Opus One Nineteen opens like this.
SPEAKER_00Was this dedicated to somebody? This piece?
SPEAKER_02Do we have any kind of um I don't know if it was explicitly dedicated to anyone, but he he all of these pieces he you know he sent drafts to to Clara. Um Clara Schumann, Robert, who's now dead. I mean, while he's while Brahms is writing this. He's dead. He actually died, I didn't tell you. He died a few years ago. I'm sorry to tell you he's not gonna make it to her podcast as a guest. Um but uh Brahms would send, you know, Clara was like a mentor to him. So she was an amazing great pianist and championed Brahms's works, like played them, played through them, gave him feedback on them uh too, like pretty honest feedback. And this was one of these pieces that he, I think with pleasure wrote to her about because uh he wanted to I think he took some pride or pleasure in in ha in explaining how painful this music is um and how loving and painful at the same time. It's very r romantic era stuff.
SPEAKER_00Because he had a lot of unrequited love for Clara Schumann.
SPEAKER_02Yes.
SPEAKER_00So when you love someone so much and you're you write something that has to do with maybe not that person, but just like the pain you feel from all the love, it's kind of also exhilarating to show that to a person that you really love and you know Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I mean, whether or not that love at this point in his life was, you know, romantic or I think it supersedes all that. I mean, this is a lifelong sort of friendship that they have. But still, it's like it's a very intimate thing to discuss the very inner workings of how you process pain and and longing, right? That's a very you're inviting someone into like your most intimate space and the music itself does that. And I think I mean, I'll just read what he wrote to her.
SPEAKER_00Um what Browns wrote to Clara about this piece that you just played a part of.
SPEAKER_02Yes, thank you for setting that up very beautifully. Um he said to her this little piece is exceptionally melancholic and is to be played very slowly. Um and that's not an understatement. Every bar and every note must sound like a retardando, which means to be played slowly or slowing down, as if one wanted to suck melancholy out of each and every one lustily and with pleasure out of these very dissonances.
SPEAKER_00So he really like almost took pleasure in his sadness and melancholy. Yeah, I mean in a sort of perverse way, which I I can understand that. I don't think I've indulged that deeply.
SPEAKER_02Are you a child of the romantic era? Do you think? What do you mean? Like, I mean, I do there is this connection between deep sorrow and love. Yeah. That that they explore to the absolute fullest. Like the sorrows of young Werther, you know, that that Goethe text. Um where he ends up committing suicide or whatever.
SPEAKER_00I haven't read it in so long, but what I find interesting about what he wrote to Clara though is he doesn't usually, isn't Roms known for less committal tempo markings, like Allegro Monontropo. Yeah. So the fact that this is just Adagio and he wrote, it should be played very slowly. That seems significant for him, if I'm remembering correctly, his tendency.
SPEAKER_02So yeah, so in other words, instead of saying adagio, but not too slow. Right, adagio monontropo, or yeah, like hey, let's let's let's not overdo things, let's keep it in this kind of middle ground space. He is kind of always in a state of searching in so much of his music when he's not like bombastically like second piano concerto, just da da da. Here, here's the music. But he does like l living in that kind of more liminal space. But you're right, here he's just like, I know what I want. A dachio. I want it to be slow, um and I want it to hurt. And I want it to hurt. And the hurt, the part of the hurt is these hair pins. So he writes these little uh designations for decrescendoing every bar, except first of all, it's actually over the first three notes in the score. So that means like get less with each note. So instead of that would be like, okay, we're just um no phrasing, no hairpin, just uh let's just play the notes as they are. In fact, let me just play it once that way, where it's just I'm not overdoing the expression, the pain, the longing, but I'm just playing what's on the page, you know, with without doing much. Okay, the pianists out there are probably cringing, but that is that's literally what's written in terms of tempo change. He's not saying poco retardando, he's not saying slow down, he's not telling you to take time anywhere. But in this letter, he does. Right. In this letter, he's saying, you better milk this stuff, you know, because this is this is pain. And I think you're first of all, you're supposed to feel that just in the dissonances, just in the harmonies themselves. And it can be hard for us because we don't live in that time. Like, I I made a short little video. One of the first Instagram videos I made was on this opening, and one of the first things I say is like, well, it's kind of jazz chords in a way. That's the perspective that we could come from on the opposite end, which is like Alright, this is a minor ninth if you stack them all together in the first measure. And then this is another just chord with extension, nine, eleven, and then ah, it's into our ears that when you play it like that, oh, it's just beautiful. It's lush, it's like debusy. And then but he wasn't hearing it like that with these open extensions where there's not a kind of chromatic leading.
SPEAKER_00Right. It's not, I mean, because it's similar to the Bach first prelude, right? That's the broken chords.
SPEAKER_02But that the you mean in the sense that they're yeah, these are arpeggiated chords. Right. Sort of.
SPEAKER_00But this piece, for some reason, it really feels like the melody does come first, or the the melody that these broken chords create is more significant, whereas with the Bach, you're almost wanting to show the chords through the brokenness.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, right. Those are the chords. I think there's so many reasons for that. One is in the Brahms, there is so man, if you look at even just the way he stems the notes, in other words, he's implying like there's a melody here, there's a melody here, there's a melody here, there's one on top. So and the fact that this is suspended through those other notes feel like they just feel like almost like the ripples of that first note. They feel like you threw a big rock into the pond here, and then now those are the ripples that are the effect of that first note, and then we get to sing a little more. And and this, these notes that are adding the extension, those would have been more painful, more dissonant, more unusual during that time than for us. I mean, we're playing, we're playing all kinds of music now that has these open, extended harmonies. But back then, I almost this is why I think it's really helpful when you're learning this music to to exaggerate uh what's happening. So if I were teaching this piece, I would probably get the student to play more than what's written. So that it feels like it feels like like you're deeper down than he even writes, so that when you return to just what's written.
SPEAKER_00Right, that's a great way to teach it because you're giving them a sense of what's not there, but what's kind of implied.
SPEAKER_02What's important, what or what's what's essential is not oh, he and he and he ends on this E or something. I mean, what's essential is just this feeling of falling. So how do we Right?
SPEAKER_00It almost could have ended on a different note. It could have. So it makes it makes the actual note it's ending on less important, and yeah.
SPEAKER_02It makes what's what he's written less precious, too. Like, as in like, uh, it always had to be these precise notes. No, I mean, you know, a different composer having the same thought, especially a few years later, might write something like that. And it's it's that it's just that painful, depressed feeling of like uh reaching out and then being denied or being in a sort of state of pain and longing and reflection that um in the romantic period is a is a wonderful, beautiful, essential kind of rumination. Um, it's just how do we access that same expression now, not having the context of Brahms's chromaticism.
SPEAKER_00What do you mean we mean because so much more has been done in more modern music that it's less like this this would have stood out as kind of more modern sounding in the time. Yeah. Obviously, because it was modern in the time.
SPEAKER_02But you know what I mean? No, yeah, in the same way that Tristan and Isolda at the time like just absolutely made a huge splash, or or or Stravinsky's Rite of Spring, how that shocked audiences to to no end.
SPEAKER_00This is an interesting thought of like what because we play all these pieces years, decades, centuries sometimes after their is that yeah, after their Yeah, Bach was a few centuries. Yeah, okay, cool, cool. Um after they're premiered.
SPEAKER_02And yeah, Bach was born in Brooklyn in 1942. He made it all the way here from Germany. Anyway, go ahead.
SPEAKER_00Okay. Um obviously we still get a lot from these pieces, but we'll never get the context that they were originally meant for. And so what we want do we take with us that's still so meaningful when we're missing so much of the context?
SPEAKER_02Yeah.
SPEAKER_00I think you can say that for any work of art, you can say that for an old movie that we still enjoy or a painting, you know, we still go to museums and we're we're absolutely, you know, it's such things are breathtaking, but we've seen we've all seen tons of paintings that are that style, or yeah, you know.
SPEAKER_02And now obviously with our phones, we can see literally any image we want that's ever been created instantly.
SPEAKER_00So make one out of our from our minds with AI.
SPEAKER_02Right. So so right, even things that we uh just yeah, have uh all we need to do is imagine, right? Um and so what is happening to experience uh for us right now? Like what is what is valuable still about or what's is newness what's important or is it just I think the deeper the more we can find a personal connection with something, the richer the experience is. So for the music, I mean, I I'm all about trying to get at what is the underlying essential emotional spirit of the music that transcends time, basically. That is basically like this is so essential to the music that we are we could be absolutely moved by it today, and it's the same kind of thing that Brahms was going for. Even if it's not, it's not exactly, and there's gonna be a lot of inside stuff um from that time and whatever, but we can just uh do our best to try to get at that expression because it is really powerful.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, but also the newness might actually have done it a disservice because I don't think humans generally want new. They they like familiar. Even when like Taylor Swift makes a new album, like I do think it's because she's still so familiar, so it's oh it's new, but it's no, it's there's a sound or her voice, and even if she reinvents herself, like like we say we want new and reinvented, but and I think in a way it's it's good for us and a part of us wants it, but but I think we can look at things that are familiar and warm and like an old movie and still get so much out of it because there's like a familiarity, like the baseline of you know, you know what I'm saying? I'm going all over the place. No, you're right.
SPEAKER_02Um I think I mean Brahms is working with tradition. So I think the reason this is powerful then is because of the chromaticism, the way that composers had treated harmony up to that point. So you did have to have some kind of reference point, and maybe that's sort of our job as musicians today is to be like, hey, let's build back a little bit of that reference point so that you can be moved again by something like this. Instead of just thinking, okay, I mean, that's just yeah, I play that all the time. I practice my two, five, ones. Like, so what? That's just like a seventh chord. And it's like, well, yeah, okay, but within the context of Brahms and the way this is happening, um, what if it was just that's essentially what's going on in the music, and then these are just added. And then you start to feel like, whoa, that thread is getting pulled like a little bit more than I expected.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_02Um, that's why I would like to practice with a student, like okay. What would that feel like to you, someone who's okay, your harmony's expanded, you know?
SPEAKER_00Are you accepting students?
SPEAKER_02Not currently, just I I'm trying to do this kind of leave him alone then. He doesn't Yeah, please. I've had to block several people already who've reached out to me incessantly about lessons. Um no, what I what I want to experiment with actually is I don't know when, but soon, uh probably on my Patreon, like these little lightning lessons where someone can send me like a five or ten minute video they're playing, and I'll send a video back either from the piano or just just walking around, but give you my give you my feedback because I don't know if you experienced this, but for me, within the first five minutes of a lesson, frankly, in the first 30 seconds of a lesson, I have a whole lesson in my head. I'm like, okay, I know what this person needs to work on. I can, I can, here's here's my lesson plan I'm building up. And after that, especially the last half of the lesson, a lot of it's just practicing with the student. Right. You know, like, okay, let's sit down and do it. But like, if I don't have that luxury because it's remote anyway, I think people could get a lot out of a really quick, essential reaction to what's happening at the piano. Um, I I think I do want to bring back teaching into my life, private teaching. I got a little burnt out from that. That's why I stopped and started doing this. But um, I think that's a that's one way to do it is these these lightning lessons that'll give you direction and guidance. Can I help you? What's up? Lightning laughing.
SPEAKER_00How long did it take you to come up with lightning lessons?
SPEAKER_02Oh my god, yeah. I I got it. I just like I woke up one morning and I was like, that's it. Whatever. It could be something else. No, I like lightning lessons.
SPEAKER_00No, no, it's not lame. Um, I also feel like you'd be back to teaching. I think this is why maybe I don't enjoy teaching so much, is that like you, I identify immediately what the problem I'm like, okay, I see what this person's problem is, or 10 problems. It's pretty obvious. It's really obvious.
SPEAKER_02It's a little like having chemistry with a person in real life. Like if you're being honest with yourself, you know pretty quick whether this is someone you're gonna get along with or not.
SPEAKER_00Right. Yes.
SPEAKER_02If you trust your instincts.
SPEAKER_00Yeah, so right away I'm just like, okay, well, they, you know, they don't their bows go in all sorts of different directions. Their their left hand is way too tight. But then what I find frustrating is I hate like breaking it to like I I I don't like sugarcoating, but I also don't like being mean. So I'd rather just take myself out of the situation.
SPEAKER_02Whoa. So you don't want to help them. That's another way to like you're more scared of hurting them than you are of than you are willing to help them.
SPEAKER_00Okay, sure. But I guess I just know that there are like so many teachers out there that they don't need my help.
SPEAKER_02Oh, wait, in this context, there's also a little bit of self-deprecation going on.
SPEAKER_00Because look, if I'm in the world and someone's like needs help on the street and I'm like I'm the first person there, I'm gonna help them because they need my help in that moment. But with teaching, I'm kind of like, you don't need my help. There's someone who's gonna be better at conveying what these problems are and helping you through it than me. So yeah, a little self-deprecation.
SPEAKER_02I think there's like a diehard four quote or something where it's like, you think anybody's gonna fix it, we're the ones who gotta fix it. Like, you do have to kind of have that mentality, especially at some point where it's like, okay, there's a kid in front of you, they need your help. This is it. Like, there is no next step. Like, you're the person who's going to save the world for this person. So you do need to at some point that classical music mindset of like, oh, who am I? Oh, I'm nobody, and my opinions are not as valid as this person teaching at a conservatory. That has to go. That has to go. And it has to go in teaching, it has to go in entrepreneurship, it has to go in career stuff. It has to like, we need to work on breaking that mentality down as soon as you get out of school. When you're in school, you should be self deprecating. You're learning and you're critiquing yourself, and you're like, I'm not as good as my teacher. I need to put my whole heart and soul into the teacher's guidance in order to like get the most. out of that if you trust them.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02But then dude, you gotta you gotta um well I mean Well there's just some people who have a knack for it.
SPEAKER_00And also Maybe there's some of that there's there's just having a lot of experience in the situations. I'm sure if I taught you know a hundred lessons in a row, all this I would figure out like, okay, these are like the the social rules of how to like navigate telling someone they have an issue and how to fix it and these are the things that work and these are the things that don't work. But I think I in my head because I so much of what I do socially is like mimicking. I don't feel like I have enough information to like properly mimic like a teacher. I don't know. That's definitely like a not everybody thing but that's how it feels for me.
SPEAKER_02You're also just not that passionate about I I think you're so disillusioned with the field, as I I mean as I kind of am too that like it doesn't jazz you up this idea of okay go get 'em tiger. Now I'm sending you out into the world into the world of what? Of classical music.
SPEAKER_00Your time could be unless I get a really, really driven disciplined student, then I'm like yes, like go for this. But otherwise I'm like, yeah.
SPEAKER_02You have too realistic a view and not an optimistic enough view of the field right now.
SPEAKER_00Yeah and with it's different with like my other stuff like comedy advice or writing advice I'm a lot better at giving that. But maybe it's because I find more joy in it. So I'm like yes like I want you to have the joy here.
SPEAKER_02What about like adult amateurs or something where it's like they are they're not going into the field. They're just doing it for the pure enjoyment of the music.
SPEAKER_00I think it's a little better because I'm also not as afraid of like somehow saying something that traumatizes them like you know I don't I don't want to say something too harsh and where a kid then like carries it for the rest of their life. I'm so scared. Okay. But it yeah if it's a fully formed adult who you know I'm not gonna Yeah.
SPEAKER_02Oh motherhood's gonna be awesome for you to um do you want to play more with the piece? Okay, okay. And speaking of that, I want to make this richer. So I oh my god this is a million years ago but I played the boring version right so um because you were young and didn't know what you were doing no no no I just for you earlier. Oh oh I thought you were like so this one time I played it really boring and I kinda was like I didn't I've never actually oh no I have performed this or I've recorded this um but I haven't played it a lot. Um I haven't really performed a lot of these late son late Roms pieces. I think partly because when you're learning them you're a little intimidated. It's like the last things he wrote besides the clarinet uh sonatas or whatever. And this is Roms returning to piano music later in life. He started Opus one with with with his uh sonata. He started at the piano he l he's a pianist but now when he's returning to the to the instrument for these intimate pieces it's like his whole style is all assimilated. He has the counterpoint that he's always been so fascinated with with Baroque composers and Renaissance composers. Um he also has he's not young anymore so he's not just being recklessly emotional. Um these things are distilled in a way that he's not wasting any space or time. He's just getting right to the interesting deep emotional stuff and delivering it in this short form way that's just very potent.
SPEAKER_00This piece is so efficient. Very efficient for how expressive and like evocative of pain and and and he wants everything everything to be milked it is also incredibly like almost m like minimal in a way.
SPEAKER_02Yeah let's let's let's let's get into it a little bit so once I add these little hair pins uh which indicate decrescendo uh I'm also gonna use those to do what he says in the letter retardando. So slow down not just get softer to evoke a little more of that pain in each measure. The very end of that first phrase now I might be overdoing it a little bit um and I but I love when this return instead of this he writes it's just extra painful there.
SPEAKER_00But also again so efficient it's just one one note making it different.
SPEAKER_02Yeah just raising that half step wild I mean he and he does indicate which notes are supposed to be held over so he's thinking harmonically of so it's not all these notes actually no I it is all those notes oh no there's no B. There's supposed to be no B. So it's not technically this is not supposed to be held. So each measure he's indicating what's held and what's not um which is also interesting to kind of explore I mean the details his intentions are pretty clear with that. Yeah they are so it's like don't just hold the pedal down right like WC right right because that just slightly genericizes the voice leading which is really where he's coming from he's not coming from a place of vertical chords and harmony he's coming from a place of each individual voice is leading somewhere beautiful to create harmony. And then oh I was thinking like because I've I've I've heard certain performances and recordings where it's much faster and I like that too. Play a little faster. Sure like to me at this tempo that I'm about to play at helps you feel the phrase more easily helps you get through the vocal line in a way that's realistically sung and not just like oh my God hurry up like we're just really ruminating on every single measure the way you feel the music when I play it that way well that still felt pretty slow and expressive.
SPEAKER_00It would be funny if the way you played it before if Brahms could hear it and was like whoa I didn't mean that.
SPEAKER_02Bro I didn't write lento I wrote a dogio again.
SPEAKER_00Yeah that just felt like it all flowed but it was still you were still really holding back in the tempo.
SPEAKER_02I feel like it was just moments that I really held.
SPEAKER_00Yeah.
SPEAKER_02I kind of like that faster tempo to be a little bit I liked that a lot better.
SPEAKER_00Um well not a lot better.
SPEAKER_02Well it was more natural. It was less like stunted it was less like I was just for you want to play no matter what happens you want to try to play in a way that feels and sounds natural that feels like it's coming from an organic place and not from a stifled or forced place. So sometimes you gotta you gotta exaggerate that too you gotta be like well let me play it super fast. Just to just to be like oh yeah that's the essential line now let me go back and add my own emotions to it. Students can be scared to do that sometimes because they feel like they're messing with the music. Like no do whatever you got to do in the practice room to feel looser. Yeah it's all subjective I mean I I and I and one night I might play it that way and another night I might feel like no I'm I'm I want to linger on every single note. Can you taste this chromaticism, this dissonance is like oh my God. Just like in life I mean we sometimes we want to enjoy things a little bit extra and sometimes we don't but it don't replicate it the same way every single time feel what you're feeling in the moment and and have a lot of different ways of performing it so you have options.
SPEAKER_00Right. I want to hear the neck the B section it's pretty different.
SPEAKER_02Let's keep going so after it's by the way oh my god I mean there's so much to talk about this beautiful counterpoint in the left hand oh there's a lot of like counter melodies going on in his music and then Pickardy third so instead of instead of adding instead of going to the dominant of the Q B minor which by the way we don't really get a solid B minor it this is B minor chord but it's really like an E minor nine so this is kind of one of the first times in this opening where it's like ah we get five of B minor.
SPEAKER_00And now we might expect this to be in the dominant the next music in the dominant key of F sharp we might you know you know we might expect that but instead we get this key to build so really quick there's something very beautiful that happens in this inner voice we have so after this eruption this is the first time it feels like you're releasing something right right I mean it feels like almost the fantasy of what the first part is kind of grieving or dealing with. Yeah. Then the fantasy is like what it could be and like what you hope it would be.
SPEAKER_02Yeah this is way out there or it's way in there. Well this feels like dealing with the present pain to me and then okay this is almost like this is like your your fantasy being over the realized in your mind being imagined nice and then listen to the inner voice here this cremat okay now that is held and it's even kept here so then that I think one of the genius things about Brahms is how he uses the same motives the same material across different sections like Beethoven did and Bach did and that makes the music feel more organic this word that you know we kind of roll our eyes at if we study classical music long enough because everyone's you know oh you can't be gonna play it more play it more organic this music is so organic and then you know it's like okay I don't know how the grocery one person used that word once and everyone was like that is a stick word used. Nailed it used in organic for the rest of my life that I but it's uh I don't know integral or something where when the materials are have a synergy uh that are working together to unfold something that feels like it's just at the right place at just the right time with just the right materials like whatever that means where form and structure and motive and harmony all meet to create something that makes you forget about the analysis and makes you feel like ah that feels right. Beethoven was a master at that you don't want to it's hard to even analyze this stuff because it's just like oh yeah I mean I could I mean the materials sometimes are that simple where it's like nothing that special is going on here but I'm utterly moved. What is happening? It just every note is at just the right time and just the right place. You know, that's organic writing.
SPEAKER_00It feels like you're discovering a melody that like the composer must have just discovered this melody that already existed in the universe.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. And then ironically they've been working their ass off to get there. I mean Brahms burned so many drafts and Beethoven was constantly scratching out his writing you know not Mozart apparently not Mozart sometimes it comes naturally let me keep playing so we can get to the end of this piece really quick. So we have this beautiful inner voices and back to D major this is a big sigh you know ah it feels so good to be in D major but it's gonna start building again okay that chord that is I mean you recognize that chord it's that chord the Tristan chord it's I mean it's technically it's a half diminished so the Tristan chord is really the Brahms opus 119.
SPEAKER_00Well this came 30 years later but yeah that after Bogner what yeah this is this is like 1890 or something oh and Tristan was like maybe the 60s 1860s yeah damn it why did I see that's one of those things like um well Brom's just lived a really long time I think that can be disorienting like I don't know why that's funny for me lived to 172 so he actually lived through the 92 not a happy person right and so just for him to live a while it just seems like this like almost God played a joke on him. Yeah to live in the I didn't I feel really stupid now I didn't know that Tristan okay so it is the Tristan chord do you think there was any direct influence?
SPEAKER_02Well I just think this half diminished quality of his chord is very it I mean he could have certainly been influenced by that but it was a chord that he used. Yeah the Tristan chord is special because of how it doesn't resolve to the right place. So that that's part of what it's not like a half diminished chord being a half diminished chord was always kind of there. Context is everything context is everything but this sounds like you know that's a modern chord too um but then from that intense suspension we get this return and now we're kind of in the beginning except with more chromaticism and changing the changing the rhythm but this is like a it's a stretto I mean like Bach did that you know in his fugues and stuff it it's like remember all these voices they're starting to pile on top of each other with more drama and then instead of a satisfying return which he could have written he goes it ends up being the same chord but this remember remember that A sharp from earlier where he went that note it's that same note version that's really wonky wow his famous sequences in his codas he does this in the viola sonata too the end of the E flat first movement so beautiful these suspensions full expression of that chord and then resolving to B minor finally yeah this it's a it's a fully diminished chord in the right hand and then over a B minor so it's like you get the self the B minor and then all of the pain that inhabits it until finally resolving and then he wrote to Claire and said this is a good one. Yeah you're gonna like this one.
SPEAKER_00Well a lot of pain in this one the third version of the like when it gets really wonky at the end there before the sequence of the coda. Yeah it makes that yeah it makes when it returns to that coda like so like warm and sad and you know it it just makes you appreciate it so much more because you've been in such a weird place. Yeah. Totally before that.
SPEAKER_02Yeah. Yeah and and you can see looking in reverse from the end you learn so much about the beginning from from approaching the end. And that's kind of another just to wrap up one of the genius things about someone like Brahms is this feels same with Bach to me. This feels improvised. It feels like he just came to the piano and was like what happens if I go down a third and another third and another third and another third let me just keep going. What what is this sound so beautiful? You know? Almost like the Beatles probably like composed some of their songs which is like okay let's just mess around how about I do it a step higher oh that's beautiful too there is an improvisatory nature to this opening it feels like someone just by themselves coming at the piano in a state of incredible sadness and just wanting this falling sound. And yet especially if you observe how the piece ends you're like it had to be those notes it had to be that many notes it like that is what organic structure really does to a piece. It makes it feel both spontaneous and meant to be that way. And there's no way you can improvise this piece. It's too it's too rich and it's counterpoint and complicated um and the way it unfolds and just the just that many bars and all that um helps with this feeling. So yeah I mean it's just thank God Brahms came back to composing because he retired, you know, uh I think an opus like 113 or something before he met that clarinetist Ricard Mufeld he heard him play and was like blown away and then he wrote the clarinet trio and then he wrote these two clarinet sonatas but in the middle of that we got these I mean some of his absolute best writing, especially for the piano.
SPEAKER_00Well it's because it kind of comes after you have n he has nothing more to prove. He had retired. Right. So if you're writing again it's purely because you were so inspired.
SPEAKER_02Yeah and for someone who had the weight of composing on his shoulders from someone like Robert Schumann and he was supposed to be the next heir of Beethoven it's finally like I'm done. I think I achieved everything I wanted to achieve now these are just dessert. Like what if we had just Brahms only composing dessert kind of different anyway. That was Brahms Opus one nineteen yeah oh man I'm in such a state of I'm like softened. I feel like I just got a massage from from that piece. I feel very like reflective right now. Anyway let's go reflect over some lunch. Okay. Bye bye everyone
